Sarah Murphree's I Am Human Too Gives Homelessness a Face

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What if people we avoid on the streets are the very people who could change us? And what if the story we told ourselves about homelessness isn't really the whole story? Today's guests spent nearly two years listening to 14 individuals living without shelter. And what she discovered wasn't just hardship, but humor, resilience, wisdom, and humanity. And I believe this conversation just may change how you see

Welcome to You Matter Nashville, where we celebrate the people and stories that make our community so special. We believe that everyone has a story to tell, and more importantly, everyone here matters.

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We're your host, Jason and Mindy Hoover, and we're passionate about shining a light on individuals who are making a real impact right here in Middle Tennessee. This is about community, connection, and the incredible people who are making a difference.

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Let's dive

in as we uncover powerful stories and meet remarkable people whose journeys will inspire us all, right here on You Matter Nashville.

Hey friends, welcome back to You Matter Nashville. I'm Jason Hoover, along with my absolutely beautiful, amazing wife. Yes, it's our 20 year year. And so I'm trying to get all the bonus points I can before our anniversary. Today we're joined by Sarah Murphy, who is the author of I Am Too, and someone who turned a deeply personal season into a journey that challenges how we see people. Sarah, so good to have you. Welcome to the show.

speaker-2 (01:28)

Thank you for having me, guys.

speaker-0 (01:31)

So before we get started, I always like to share about our guests with our listeners so that they kind of know a little bit about you. So I'm just going to read this bio here for everybody. Says here that Sarah is an author, actress, and mental health advocate. She's the daughter of a mother who lives with a mental health condition, and that experience really shaped the direction of her work. She serves as a peer educator with the mental health awareness program, End the Silence.

and is involved with the National Alliance on Mental Illness. She studied journalism with minors in screenwriting and theater, which I love, because you can see both of those in the storytelling and heart that come through in her writing. And before writing her own book, she worked as a photojournalist in Haiti, Ecuador, and Nepal, focusing on global poverty. And now she's the author of I Am Human Too, which is a book that shapes the stories of 14 individuals experiencing homelessness,

and invites us to see the person before the circumstance.

speaker-1 (02:33)

Well, Sarah, before we talk about the book itself, ⁓ what first stirred your heart towards this topic in homelessness?

speaker-2 (02:45)

Yeah, that's a great question. ⁓ I believe what first, well, as a kid, I always was very observant of people on the street, but I was really kind of taught to, know, give a few dollars when you can, but kind of keep your distance. I think this narrative that most homeless people are addicts or drunks and they just want your money for beer or alcohol was kind of a narrative I heard a lot from the adults in my life, even different teachers. And

I think what really changed for me was when my own mother was diagnosed with a mental health condition. And I really began to, you know, see people on the street as not just a stranger, but like, I began to think, what if my mother ended up on housed? ⁓ What would she want? And I realized, and I knew this at my core, if my mom ever ended up on, if my mom ever ended up on housed, what she would want was somebody to.

look her in the eye and acknowledge that her life mattered and to talk to her.

speaker-1 (03:48)

Amen.

speaker-0 (03:49)

Yes. Too many times we lose sight of that and we, it's easy to look past people and you really have to slow down sometimes to just think, you know, even they're homeless, they're still people, they're still valid. They still matter to the community.

speaker-2 (04:01)

Yeah.

speaker-1 (04:14)

Absolutely. Do we know approximately the percentage of people who are battling, ⁓ like mental conditions and are unhoused?

speaker-2 (04:28)

Yes, well, at the time of this book, ⁓ there was people in the United States who were struggling with a mental illness were 30%. And I remember that. Yeah, shook me because I think the narrative is there's maybe 70%, but it really wasn't as big a number ⁓ as I imagined.

speaker-1 (04:48)

But still, 30 % is significant.

speaker-2 (04:52)

That is so true, yeah. And to think they're battling mental health conditions without a home, it's just like, oof.

speaker-1 (05:00)

Right.

speaker-0 (05:01)

So let's go back to your early years, know, 21 and with your mother being diagnosed. I know there was, there was a dynamic that comes along with that in the family and it's a season. So I'm curious. And then there's a lot of us that experience it and, and, and I say us like personal, I mean us as a community, as a people, what was that season?

like to you? What did it feel like personally at that moment, just getting into it?

speaker-2 (05:37)

Yes. Well, when she was diagnosed with a mental health condition when I was 21, I'd always felt she was struggling with her mental health. And I kind of knew it. But to have a psychologist say you have a diet, clinical diagnosed mental health condition just made it real. I was like, this is real now. And at the time, you know, school systems really didn't educate kids about mental health. And so

All I knew is that people with a mental health condition end up in a mental institution or on the street. And that developed.

speaker-0 (06:12)

That's so sad.

It's so sad because I believe mental health can be ⁓ resolved. I love that we're talking about it more. And it's not becoming a stigma of all that person's crazy. know, we used to, it used to be jokes, know, being Gen X we'd grow up and it was a joke. You the, ⁓ you're seeing a crazy person or, know, the crazy doctor. And ⁓ even though it was a joke, it calls people to be silent.

speaker-2 (06:24)

Yeah.

speaker-0 (06:45)

and suffer alone.

speaker-1 (06:47)

Or, you know, especially with men, you got help, it demasculin- you know what saying? Like it wasn't you weren't a real man or something if you got help for an issue. And now it's seen as this can literally happen to anyone. And there are resources and to get help. I think just as a nation, we are slowly moving towards help being affordable.

or insurance covering more things. We're used to, you it never would cover therapy or now you're seeing copays and you're seeing clinics and free clinics, sliding scales. You're seeing all of these things come up where 15 years ago it was unheard of. So I feel that we are moving towards that direction, but I think that comes with sympathy and empathy and people pushing that to happen. So it's, you know, I think we're coming a long way, but we have a long way to go.

speaker-0 (07:45)

Yeah.

speaker-2 (07:46)

Yeah. And it's interesting you guys say that because, you know, even talking to my mom and I want to mention this before publishing this book, I let my mom read it and asked her what she thought. And if she wanted anything changed, you know, cause she's a part of this story as well. Yeah. Yeah. You know, it's, so I remember, um, her reading the parts where she's in this and I said, are you okay if I publish this? And she said, I want you to publish that because it's the truth.

speaker-1 (08:01)

Yeah. ⁓

speaker-2 (08:15)

and the truth must be told. And in some ways I feel this book has healed her because I have found when people struggling with their mental health, ⁓ it's like brought to light suddenly. the shame is kind of dissolved and it lifts something.

speaker-1 (08:32)

love that. Because shame likes to live in things hidden, right? Like when you are by yourself and you isolate, that's where shame likes to thrive. So living in that transparency is that that's great. That's a beautiful way to put it.

speaker-0 (08:47)

Yeah, in your book, you also mention about ⁓ at first your family didn't talk about it, right? Which I think is very common. I think it's very common.

speaker-1 (08:56)

It's like

the elephant in the room, everybody's ignoring it.

speaker-0 (09:01)

But how did that silence impact you? ⁓

speaker-2 (09:05)

Hmm. I mean, I think everything I do today now is because I was raised in silence in many ways. And I found it wasn't just my family. Every kid I knew if they had a, you know, a parent struggling with a mental health condition, um, it was always silence. And I think it all comes back to shame. And even what you mentioned earlier, you know, people being labeled as crazy. I would ask my mom about getting therapy or help, but you know,

it took her so long to be diagnosed with a mental health condition because in many ways she felt the biggest, you know, she felt the worst thing that could happen to her in life is being labeled as crazy and going to therapy is for people who are crazy. You know, this whole narrative. That's why it took so long in many ways ⁓ for help to come through.

speaker-1 (10:00)

It'd be amazing if a whole generation got the tools that they needed in therapy, breaking those chains, those generational curses, as a lot of us call them. But it's like if a whole generation caught on to healing, imagine why it could stop. It just takes time. And every family has its own journey, for sure.

speaker-0 (10:25)

Well, and it's one of those unseen, ⁓ disabilities, and sort of like the fibromyalgia that you live in pain and, people can't see it. Right. So, you know, I think it's a lot like that because people walk around, they, you know, could look normal. ⁓ most of them do. And I think, I think

speaker-2 (10:30)

Mm.

I mean, I'm just

going to say, you go,

speaker-0 (10:54)

No,

no, no, no, please. You're the guest. You go, please.

speaker-2 (10:57)

No, I was just gonna say after, ⁓ when you said people walk around and can look like so normal and like they have it all together, for most of my life, that really was my mother. So when I talked to people about this other side that when she got triggered, ⁓ she would have these mental health episodes, people were just like, your mom, no. So that was a whole journey of, wow, I do think a lot of people can mask it and hide it for years.

speaker-1 (11:25)

Yeah.

speaker-0 (11:26)

Yeah, we're all battling something.

speaker-1 (11:28)

We're all battling. So maybe we should have all got disclaimers from our family members to talk about it today, but we did it. Yeah. But the point is, that every family, every family has someone that is battling something. I don't know a family. I don't know any of my friends who don't have someone that is, if they're not battling some kind of chemical imbalance, it is an addiction with it, which is also classified now as ⁓

you know, disease or mental condition. it affects every family, every single family. So this is like, this is why this should be so important to insurance and to our government, because this is not something that it's like so sparse that it's not affecting or touching our lives.

speaker-2 (12:17)

Yeah. And it's so interesting when you guys were asking about stats. Because now in the world, one in three people battle with a mental health condition or mental illness. And so when I hear this number, I'm like, if you have a mom and a dad and a kid, somebody struggling. if we think we look at that number one in three, it's like, oh, we're all in this together. So if we realized that the shame should be dissolved, hopefully, with time.

speaker-1 (12:44)

Yeah, and the more social media takes hold of our lives and the more forced transparency we have, mean, I think it's just going to keep on climbing.

speaker-0 (12:55)

Yeah, it's the isolation I think that what drives people to extreme measures. because if they feel isolated, they feel alone and that it's a cycle. It becomes that cycle ever downward sparring out, spiraling out of control.

speaker-1 (13:18)

Yeah. Or seeing that everybody out there is perfect. Yes. Social media, everything out there is perfect. I'm comparison and I'm not, yeah, I don't have any of that. I don't, yeah. It's this separation of I am so imperfect and they are perfect. anyway, it's, could keep going down that rabbit hole of, but it's just, the point is it, it affects everyone. And we are all just a couple months.

speaker-0 (13:24)

compare

speaker-1 (13:47)

of savings away from, you know, homelessness or being unhoused. mean, it's, when you think about all of that, how close we are to the people who are out there suffering, it's, there's, there's not like this huge separation.

speaker-2 (14:03)

That is so true. And I think that's when I went on this journey of spending almost two years with people who are on house. That is exactly what I found is every single person reminded me of like a friend or cousin or teacher. I'm like, my gosh. Yeah. Yeah.

speaker-1 (14:18)

This could be someone I knew.

speaker-0 (14:22)

So let's go ahead and talk about that. ⁓ So you were in college at UT of Knoxville, and I'm going to let you ⁓ pick it up from there. Yes. Because you share about that moment when you saw somebody. So I'll let you pick it up from there and share with our listeners.

speaker-2 (14:41)

Yes, I think the moment that really changed my life and set me on this journey to pursue this book was it was shortly after my mom had been diagnosed with a mental health condition. And I realized I had never really stopped to look a homeless person in the eyes. I always kind of avoided eye contact. Even if I waved or gave a couple dollars, it was always like, Oh, here you go. Have a good day. Um, but I was walking to my college class as a senior at UT Knoxville and I passed this man.

And something in me just said like, look at him. And I decided I needed to stop being afraid of what I feared most was, and that was my mom, maybe one day being in his shoes. So I stopped and I watched him and he had his grocery card of all his stuff. And, you know, he had holes in his shoes and he had tin foil on his head and was kind of waving things around. Like there was something there.

when he was hearing voices and I watched him have this mental episode and once he came out of it, he realized I was standing there and we just made eye contact. And even though this man was not my mother and I didn't know his name, when I looked him in the eyes, I like saw just like this could be her and him having this mental episode. ⁓ My mom had had those before and so I witnessed that before and so.

I was just like, my goodness, like.

my goodness, this is a man. This is like a human. And it was so easy for me not to necessarily see him as a person until I looked him in the eyes. And after that, I just like wept and something in my heart just broke of like, my gosh, this is a human and this is, he's struggling with all this and sleeps on the sidewalk. And so I realized, you know, I was a broke college kid and I was like, made a list of like, what can I do to

speaker-1 (16:35)

Yeah.

speaker-2 (16:43)

How can I help? And I made a list and I realized the only thing I could do was write. And I said, okay, if this is all I can do, this is what I'm gonna do.

speaker-0 (16:54)

Yeah. I love that you say that, you know, it's, I know you say all I can do, but that's what was, or that is what's most important is you're helping give them a voice.

speaker-1 (17:06)

Yeah, and using your giftings the way that you should.

speaker-2 (17:10)

Yeah. And it's interesting because some people ask me like, did these people want to talk to you or be interviewed? And when the journey began to write this book, ⁓ people would come from miles just for me to interview them. And yeah, everybody wanted to tell me their story, which is what I really didn't expect.

speaker-1 (17:26)

stories.

That's strong.

speaker-0 (17:34)

That is very strong. So I know a lot of times and you know, we, I've been guilty of it is that you think when you see the people on the streets that are to us appear erratic, you know, wavened, shouting, ⁓ it's easy to think it's a drug related issue and that is not always the case. It's, it's a mental battle and

Unless, unless you experience it, you know, have not experienced it, you know, and I'm, I'm thinking unless you can, you truly don't know the world that they're living in, what it's like, you know, it's not as easy, I would suspect to go get help, even though there's help available in different places, but you're living in a whole different paradigm of sorts.

speaker-2 (18:30)

Right. That is so true. And I really have to give a shout out to NAMI, which stands for the National Alliance of Mental Illness. And they're the largest nonprofit in the world for mental health. And because they're a nonprofit, they offer these free courses where you can learn everything about mental health. And I took these courses after my mom was diagnosed and they teach you about schizophrenia, bipolar, alcoholism, like why these things happen. How do you talk to these people? How do you help these people?

And what I found that just blew my mind was women who have schizophrenia or multiple personality disorder. It's like 90 % of them were molested or raped. And many people think that number is like a hundred percent, but people sometimes lie due to shame. And once I learned that and spending time with people who are on house and seeing that narrative and that story over and over again, that they were molested, they were molested and learning, you know,

through these classes that if you don't get help for that quickly, it really can snap something in your mind.

speaker-0 (19:35)

Yeah.

speaker-1 (19:36)

I mean, for being a teacher, ⁓ many years, lot of the students you saw have issues are withdrawn or a lot of them, you look at their file and there was a family history of that. And it's, don't think people realize how deep those wounds stay. Yeah. You know, ⁓ I mean, especially the molesting when you're talking about family trust.

and not the, you don't have a safe haven, right? So I mean, we, we would see a lot of that in our student population over the kids that were had the humiliating, the horrible grades, the withdrawal or anger, however they decide to. Yeah, but yeah, it's, it starts out young and like she keeps snowballing.

speaker-0 (20:11)

And it's humiliating.

speaker-2 (20:26)

So true. And it's so powerful, the words you use, like withdrawn and anger, because that is what I found, like women or men on the street. Yeah. It's kind of like they're still a withdrawn child in some ways.

speaker-1 (20:39)

Yeah.

So, so interesting that a lot of the people shared that with you.

speaker-2 (20:44)

Yeah.

speaker-1 (20:45)

Now, when you were in college, you had this incident, but you did go into an internship that kind of was a catalyst for writing this book. I'd love to hear about that time in your life and how that kind of switched over for you.

speaker-2 (21:03)

Yes, it's so wild because I was on a track to be a news anchor. That was my like journalistic track. And so to graduate, we had to do a three month internship at like the newspaper or news station. And once I looked that man in the eye, I just, it's so wild. It's maybe God just came in and was like, nope. But I was like, I can't be a news anchor. I just couldn't do it. And in Knoxville, there was a street paper where people on the street sold it.

as a way to get a job and help them get off the street. And, know, I would see it many times going to college. There's one in Nashville too, ⁓ called The Contributor. And I was like, this is a newspaper and this matters. these, these are the stories I want to tell. ⁓ So I, you know, went to my teacher and I was like, I'd like to do my internship here. And she's like, we don't recognize street papers as real papers. And she goes, you can take it up with the dean if you want.

speaker-0 (21:57)

Hmm.

speaker-2 (22:01)

And now I'm like, I don't know who that 21 year old was, but I guess the passion of my mom, this could be my mom, we got to get these stories out. went to the Dean and I told, I like had a pitch because it's so wild. mean, talk about maybe meant to be excited. Googled internships at street papers and believe it or not, they were looking for an intern. ⁓

Knoxville, you know, street paper called the amplifier. And I was like, this is it. Three month internship to work with people who are on housed and tell their stories. So I went to the Dean. I'm like, ⁓ my gosh, this kid. And, but I was very scared. You know, he was going to say, no, I'm good. And then, you know, I'm going to be kicked out. don't know. Anyway, I told him, this is really where I feel these stories matter. ⁓ but he signed off on it.

He was like, okay.

speaker-1 (23:01)

Because he'd be a bad person if he said no to homosexuals.

speaker-2 (23:05)

Perky.

speaker-1 (23:10)

You're the volunteer state. you're going to say no to all the unhoused we have. mean, that is on you. For seeing your passion and seeing that this is going to be a huge learning opportunity for you. Because he could have said no. And then where would you be right now? You know, that is.

speaker-2 (23:16)

Okay,

So

that is so powerful and true. One. Yes. Yes. Is why this book is here. Yeah. So then it began. ⁓ And it was a lot of like serving people on the street, writing their stories, helping them edit their stories, interviewing them. And after three months of spending time with them, ⁓ I just couldn't walk away. And, you know, the man who ran the paper, his name is Eddie Young. This book is dedicated to him. He really changed my life.

And on my first day of the internship, goes, we have one rule here. And I was like, okay, what is it? He goes, we call people on the street our friends.

speaker-0 (24:08)

that.

speaker-2 (24:09)

And

goes, yeah, and I'm telling you that whole mindset shift of calling them your friends. And he goes, if you call them your friends, you'd be surprised at how quickly they will become a friend.

speaker-0 (24:22)

I

love that.

speaker-1 (24:24)

Instead of referring them to them, like a separation. Yeah. Your friends. Those people, the homeless.

speaker-2 (24:33)

Yeah. So that changed everything. And after three months, they really were my friends. And now that I knew like their names of like, this is Brenda and Steven. And like, I knew their stories. I was like, my gosh, I have to do something. And so I asked to stay on.

speaker-1 (24:50)

Out of all those that you have spoke to and formed relationships with, how many of them have been able to become housed since then? Do you know?

speaker-2 (25:01)

Well, this part is a bit sad, but I guess before I wrote this book, I read every book I could on homelessness to see what was out there. And what I found was most books written about homelessness were written by someone like a memoir of somebody who had been homeless and got off the streets, or they were written by a journalist kind of writing about facts and the economy. And I realized where's the book about people who don't make it off the street because that's the majority.

speaker-1 (25:30)

Yeah.

speaker-0 (25:31)

Yeah.

speaker-2 (25:31)

And so I think, you know, in this book, these are the bulk of people who I feel are the majority of on-house people. These are the ones who are, don't make it off the street. But I will say there's, yeah. And there's 14 stories, but the last story of the book ⁓ is a man who makes it off the street and gets housed. But once you read his story, you realize the resilience it takes to get housed once you're on-house.

It is like the stamina you have to have is unreal

speaker-1 (26:06)

It's stacked against you unless you have like an organization backing you and, you know, speaking up for you. I mean, even to get a job, you know, so it's, it takes a village. Yeah.

speaker-2 (26:16)

⁓ yeah.

speaker-0 (26:22)

So interviewing these 14, ⁓ did you find that there was ⁓ like a common thought or common theme of what they would want us to know?

speaker-2 (26:35)

Mm-hmm Yes, that is a beautiful question. I think a few things come up I think one is that I find a lot of people tend to be a little scared of homeless people They never know, know what they're gonna say or maybe they're drunk or on drugs But what I found is people on the street are so much more afraid of people who are housed They are afraid of us Walking by them

And that blew my mind. And when I was really like, is that? And a bunch of my friends on the street would tell me, well, if something happens and the cops come, they're not. And so we walk around knowing like 911 is not an option anymore. Like nobody's coming to save us, but they would help a house person. So I thought that was very fascinating of they sometimes like get triggered or may have a middle episode around like

speaker-1 (27:13)

He's gonna be blamed. Yeah. Right.

speaker-0 (27:15)

Right.

.

speaker-2 (27:33)

Maybe I'm pumping gas in my car, you know, and it kind of like, if I, I find they can spiral quickly of like, if I say the wrong thing to them, they may call 911, what's going to happen. So that really just blew my mind. Um, I think one other thing that comes to mind is that I had one friend on the street telling me when you're treated like a dog for so long, sometimes you just start to act like.

speaker-1 (27:59)

It's so true though. You know, that's just, you know, the words that you have coming out and what you hear, know.

speaker-2 (28:06)

Yeah

speaker-0 (28:08)

You know, that the brain does adapt. Yes. You know, even in the self-help world, you know, they talk about your brain adapts to what you call yourself constantly and what you accept other people to call you. So, yeah, I see that complete. And those are things that we never think about. We don't think about they're conforming to what others are saying. And when the others are saying, well, they can get off the street.

I wished it was that simple, but it's not. I mean, I'm no expert by any means by far stretch, but I do know a mental illness, how it can, it can literally freeze you from doing things and block you from understanding simple, simple things. now in your, your website, which by the way, ⁓ I want to share.

trying to find it here. Share your website to go look at your book as well. But your website is yourname.com, sarahmerphy.com. ⁓ And I love how simple you are. Then you got it's four slash the book. The book. love this. Don't make it hard.

speaker-1 (29:24)

the Make it.

speaker-2 (29:29)

Yeah.

speaker-1 (29:30)

Make it easy.

speaker-0 (29:31)

But I do want people that those that are listening, you can check it out here and ⁓ it's well, I'm getting off my question because it also on here says it's a Pulitzer consideration, which is amazing. That's, that's fantastic. Where is there any update on that?

speaker-2 (29:49)

I believe they announced them in April or May. ⁓ I've learned, you know, I mean, I never would have imagined this happened. And the publisher who helped me get this out really is the one who was like, you gotta submit it for consideration. So I've learned it's under consideration. And I guess from there, the staff, whoever the Pulitzer people are, you know, they nominate maybe like 10. ⁓

speaker-1 (29:52)

Okay.

right.

speaker-2 (30:17)

Then you go from consideration to nominated and then the, you know. So I guess in April they announced the nominees and then in May they announced the one who.

speaker-0 (30:28)

selected.

speaker-1 (30:28)

Yeah, so it's an exciting time, kind of just waiting on the edge of your seat to see what happens next. But it's exciting just to, you know, going through the process and having that confidence of someone who felt that it needed to be heard. So that's pretty amazing too.

speaker-0 (30:45)

So my question I was going to ask is that on here it says, you say your book's not about homelessness, but humanity, which I love that. I love that viewpoint. ⁓ What does that distinction mean to you?

speaker-2 (31:03)

Yes, I believe it means that, you know, these are people too. And once you learn their name, it is very hard to see them as a homeless person. And I think when people read these stories, my hope is that once they finish the book, it's not like those homeless people, it's like, oh my gosh, what happened to Stephen and Brenda? You know, it could happen to any one of us. my real dream.

is that this book would become a ripple effect and after everybody read it, they'd fill a pool to befriend one person on the street. And I really believe that house people and on-house people need each other. yeah, I will say the on-house people, like, they really changed my whole life and my perspective. And they had the most faith of people I'd ever met in my entire life.

And they really taught me more about faith in the Bible than like the church did. So I'm just like saying that because it's like, you'd be so surprised what gifts can come from people who have nothing to their name.

speaker-0 (32:09)

Yeah.

speaker-1 (32:10)

So the start of this was seeing your mother in them. How did going through this process help you to understand your mother in return?

speaker-2 (32:23)

Yeah, that's a very powerful question. feel like after I spent two years with people who are on house, I just understood my mother fully. And in some ways, you know, my mom was very silent about her mental health, but the people who were experiencing homelessness were not. And in many ways they had similar symptoms, but they would tell me why they were experiencing that or their fears or that they lived in fight or flight and

speaker-1 (32:52)

Yeah.

speaker-2 (32:53)

I feel like I just understood my mother fully.

speaker-0 (32:56)

Hmm.

speaker-1 (32:58)

Probably growing up with a parent that has mental illness, it's sometimes hard to have compassion, even if they get diagnosed and they get, you still have those feelings of growing up in that. So I'm sure just being able to talk to other people that were undiagnosed, it helps you to have compassion through a situation that you personally, because it's not just your mom going through this. You went through your mother having a mental illness that was being untreated.

for most of your life. that affects you as a child, affects you as an adult. And I know just from personal experience, you have to learn that compassion. had said you kind of dove into learning about the different mental illnesses. You know, I had shared with Jason, I had poured myself into psychology classes that I didn't, they weren't even a requirement for me in college, but I needed to understand

people in my family. needed to understand, like my grandfather who was passed was diagnosed with bipolar. ⁓ And he was medicated the majority of my life, thank God. But just being able to understand that and getting my arms around, weren't angry at me. Like this was something out of their control, helped with the compassion that I had for other people in my life. ⁓ So it's interesting.

speaker-2 (34:19)

Yeah.

speaker-1 (34:26)

We're not like born with this empathy, right? Born with this empathy with people who don't have this amazing, perfect homeostasis, you this perfect loveliness about them. I think just education and learning, having relationships with people who have all these issues, I think it kind of softens you. I...

speaker-2 (34:32)

Yeah.

speaker-1 (34:54)

Anyway, all that to say, mean, you went through this too. I went through this too. A lot of us go through this and it shapes who we are. it can make you hard or it can make you soft.

speaker-2 (35:01)

Yeah.

Wow, that's such a powerful statement. I definitely agree to that. It can make you bitter or make you like empathetic. Yeah. It's yeah. I was like.

speaker-1 (35:15)

Yeah. Yeah. It's

a lot. It's a kind of a impactful paragraph I gave, but it's but it's a real thing. It's it's heavy either way. Being a child that is raised by, you know, in those circumstances. But I think, you know, having

grown up like that I think it's made me a more understanding and loving person. You know when you have to love your family that's that's through there but.

speaker-2 (35:48)

Yeah.

Yeah.

speaker-0 (35:54)

So you do you have a ⁓ good relationship with your mother now?

speaker-2 (35:59)

I do, I feel like she calls me almost every day, every other day. But I think sometimes I like, I don't know, I laugh because I'm like thinking about me being her kid. But I'm like, I feel like if my mom was able to get help sooner in life, I'm like, you would have been this person mom, who's me. But I think my mom, she was raised in a very traditional home.

where women don't talk about these things. There definitely was a period when I started this book when I was 21 of she was horrified. She's like, women do not talk to the homeless. What are you doing? And now you're writing a book about the homeless. ⁓ my gosh.

speaker-1 (36:47)

is not

what southern women do.

speaker-2 (36:50)

Exactly.

⁓ was all that. Every day. Just, I could hear it now, like, just be a nurse and call it a day.

speaker-1 (36:58)

Sounds like my family. can't you just, you know, have a normal job? Yeah.

speaker-2 (37:06)

So it's so interesting of like, she was very against this book and just horrified. Like her daughter would talk about this and then write about this, but it took 10 years for the book to get out. So now it's been almost over 10 years since I wrote this. And I, over the years, like me taking these mental health classes with the national nights of mental illness or getting different books about mental health, I would bring them to her and I would show them to her and she would never look at them in front of me. ⁓

but I began to learn she would read them. And as the years have gone.

speaker-1 (37:39)

and

okay

speaker-2 (37:41)

Yeah, it's like, would say now, I mean, my husband and I joke, I'm like, man, my mother's done a 180 now. She'll clip news articles about the homeless and save them for me. And my mom says like very simple sentences that are very powerful. So I think in some ways reading this book, she was like, oh, I understand.

And she was like, I understand why they live in their tents and they don't want to be out of their tents. And I was like, my mom's never been on the street. So I'm like, why do you understand that? And she was set. said, well, because they don't want to be alone and they like being around people that understand what they're going through. So she really answers, you know, it's like, yeah, she's really has a lot of insight and, and she's very funny. And I think in many ways, humor.

speaker-0 (38:25)

Hmm

It's a good insight.

speaker-2 (38:38)

is what has saved my mom's mind. Because when I talk about, yeah, so true. When I talk about the book now, she's very proud of it. And she always says like, you know, Sarah, I'm gonna tell you, everybody is a little mentally ill. You're gonna realize we're all a little mentally ill. I'm like, you know, you got some truth there. We all have baggage.

speaker-1 (39:06)

baggage. all bringing in our own, our own ideals and our own weird stuff that our family gave us. So, you know, it's just what makes us us. Is there a normal? No, I don't think there is actually a normal.

speaker-2 (39:16)

Yeah.

I know, but to answer one more thing you said, I think the most powerful thing my mother told me after years of me bringing her books about mental health and how to heal it and what is it is that she told me one day, know, Sarah, I don't always understand my emotions and I don't often understand what's going in my mind when certain things happen and that is scary. I don't understand why it's happening to me, why me?

why I can't figure out what this is when my emotions take over. So, yeah, I think I've found that she's become more honest with this book coming out. ⁓ yeah, I think in some ways, even when you were saying earlier, like a parent who has a mental illness definitely affects a child. And I think later in life,

When I was like 18 years old, my mom set me down and she's like, I'm sorry, I couldn't always be a mom for you. I'm sorry, I couldn't always show up, but I want you to know I wanted to show up. And that's when I realized I didn't feel better. I was like, this is my own journey. I have to go on because my mom's number one symptom was depression. So when she felt ashamed or

speaker-0 (40:33)

That's all. Yeah.

speaker-2 (40:50)

relived past trauma, it was hard for her to get out of bed. And now I like understand mental health so much more and going through life as a human further, I'm like, oh, I get it. But as a kid, I just wanted mom to get out of the bed.

speaker-0 (41:06)

Hmm. But yeah, because you didn't understand.

speaker-2 (41:10)

I understand. But she did say this and, you know, she said ⁓ sometimes she's like, you know, Sarah, sometimes it's easier to sleep than face life.

speaker-0 (41:21)

Yes.

speaker-1 (41:22)

It's interesting how everyone, you know, when they're going through that, how they, how they choose a way to deal. And I know personally with my family, it was if things got rough, you just worked more. It was kind of the opposite. You fill your day so full, you don't have to think about it. And avoidance, you know, it's, but everybody kind of, if they don't get the help you need, you find a way to cope.

speaker-2 (41:39)

Yeah

Yeah.

speaker-1 (41:52)

on your own.

speaker-2 (41:54)

Yeah.

speaker-0 (41:56)

And

the bad thing about that is you never resolve it.

speaker-1 (42:00)

No, either way you're not resolving. you're disassociating or pushing the thoughts out or you're feeling yourself full of it and isolating. It's crazy how our minds naturally go to those defense mechanisms on our own. That is why community is so important. And like your mom was saying,

speaker-2 (42:14)

Yeah.

speaker-1 (42:29)

They're finding solace. They're finding sanity in one another, finding other people that are like them so they can identify, you know? that I've never thought of it that way. I mean, that's really eye-opening for me, but it makes sense. That's why you have your villages in different places of Nashville, because they need each other. You need community.

speaker-2 (42:40)

Yeah.

You just, yeah. That's very powerful. And I think too, you asked like in some ways what began the full story and going back to a little girl with a mom who was struggling with her mental health. I remember when the internet came out, one of the first things I Googled was daughters of moms with mental illness and nothing came up. And every few years I Googled that nothing came up.

speaker-0 (43:21)

Really?

speaker-2 (43:22)

And throughout my life, I met so many daughters of moms with mental illness. And I literally was like, what happens to the daughter? And I feel like in some ways these, maybe I was meant to meet all these daughters and they were often the most unlikely candidates you'd ever imagine or with the most put together mothers. you're like, so I think my ultimate great dream in life is like, even through this book is like showing like,

mental health always affects the child. Even if the child, but the child often internalizes it. If it's really a parent struggling. So yeah, that's definitely part of this journey too of like, let me face this thing that I wasn't allowed to talk about that I had to keep internal for so many years.

speaker-0 (44:16)

Right.

speaker-1 (44:19)

Switching gears just a little, I wanna hear a little bit about these interviews and that were so personal to you. ⁓ Was there a particular story ⁓ you had mentioned earlier, a gentleman that really touched your heart? Is there any specific story that really changed your thought process or pivotal moment in your writing?

speaker-2 (44:45)

Yes. gosh, there's so many that come to mind. ⁓ but I think one man in particular named David, he really touched me. And what I love about this book is everybody who reads it has like one person they like really identify with. They're like, ⁓ my gosh, I know this person. I think, yeah, that's so true. Choose your friend. Yes. ⁓ but David

speaker-0 (45:03)

like friends.

speaker-1 (45:04)

Yeah.

speaker-2 (45:12)

I really identified with him a lot because he was struggling with depression very deeply. And in some ways you're asking like how I began to understand my mother through these people. like saw somebody that reminded me of my mom. He was very ashamed at where he ended up in life. ⁓ And as a result, he was withdrawn. And what broke my heart is that he didn't have health insurance for a period of time. He was a painter. He painted houses and he fell off a ladder and broke his back.

And the surgery cost him $100,000. And 10 years ago, you know, $100,000, it was like immediate debt. And then he couldn't walk for 10 months because he had to recover from a broken back. And that's literally what spiraled him to the street. And he was so ashamed that he ended. And he would tell me, I was like, I remember in the book, and he says this, if I could have bet everything I had that I would never be a homeless man.

like years prior to this injury, I would have bet everything I would never be a homeless man. ⁓ But he had a daughter and a son and I just have a younger brother. So in some ways it felt like very familiar and his daughter was my age at the time and his son was going to UT. And I remember thinking like, my gosh, I'm walking this UT campus and one of these boys my age, this is his father.

speaker-1 (46:41)

Wow.

speaker-2 (46:42)

Like, who is that kid?

speaker-1 (46:44)

Right.

speaker-2 (46:46)

Yeah, but he really had such a wisdom about depression and he said a few things that really changed me and he said, when you end up like this, you just try to stay out of everybody's way because it's too shameful. And I really thought, wow. But he also said, when you're going through deep depression, there's usually, you know, a deep wound or pain. And he felt deeply pained by not being there for his daughter.

because his daughter used to call him and find him and be like, I don't care if you're homeless, like come to my cheerleading meets, sit in the bleachers, I don't care, dad. ⁓ And so he told me at the time when you're deeply depressed about whatever that is, and that was his daughter at the time of not being able to show up for due to his shame, that when you find people that are similar to them, it brings kind of a comfort. And so he said, I reminded him of his daughter and...

Ironically, he reminded me of my father very, much. And I'm very close to my dad. ⁓ But my dad died right before this book came out. ⁓ I know. ⁓ I can't cry. Never stop. But even though I wrote this book 10 years ago, after my dad died, I really thought of David and I thought, my gosh, I felt so much comfort with this man 10 years ago because he reminded me of my father.

And he had taught me and it stuck with me in my mind. Like when you find people that remind you of your loss, like what's eating you. And for me, the loss of my father, it's kind of comforting to be around people that remind you of your dad. And I've definitely found that to be true.

speaker-0 (48:34)

I don't even know what to say. mean that was hell.

speaker-2 (48:36)

Yeah.

speaker-1 (48:37)

I I

was like giving that to Jason and he's like, no.

speaker-0 (48:42)

That was heavy. ⁓

speaker-2 (48:46)

Well, I think I'll say this to maybe light not lighten it, but you wrap that up. ⁓ Even though I wrote this book, the first draft and experienced this 10 years ago, I wake up and I remember these stories like it was yesterday.

speaker-1 (49:03)

Because it's still meaningful to you. It's still in your heart.

speaker-2 (49:07)

Yes. And I think somebody told me, well, maybe that's because you're having a real human experience. And most of us go through life, work, busy, clean the home, laundry, like we're kind of moving fast instead of just like looking at a human and being like, hey, how will you do?

speaker-1 (49:26)

creating connection, meaningful connection.

speaker-0 (49:31)

So if you could sit across from someone who is feeling invisible right now, maybe they're not homeless, but they feel unseen. What would you like them to hear?

speaker-2 (49:48)

I think that question is very powerful because when you say if I could sit across from anybody that feels unseen immediately, tons of people come to mind ⁓ who are friends, loved ones, family members. And my first thought is I'd want them to know I see you. ⁓ But what I find interesting is like,

You know, I think we, in this society, it moves very fast. And with social media, it can easily, and the internet, there's just so many things coming at us, demanding our attention. And as you asked me that, I'm thinking about a handful of people that I should call and let them know, I see you, I know what you're growing through, but I'm like rushing through life. And so I find like, if we don't stop to take the time to speak with the person on the street we feel drawn to, we like,

really don't stop to take the time to call her mother or reach out to that old friend from high school or reach out to the cousin. I find like it's kind of a mindset switch. Like if we are able to slow down and talk to somebody on the street, I find in our lives, we're able to slow down and talk to the loved ones that need us just as much.

speaker-0 (51:08)

You know, this, this goes so deep ⁓ because it's it's a, it's a mental issue. It's a heart issue. lot of times as well, sometimes it's addiction. There's so much going on.

speaker-1 (51:25)

For someone in middle Tennessee or wherever our listeners are at today, and they see someone on the corner, and they may see them every day on the way to work, what is one small, just human step that they should do this week? What small step could they make connecting with someone that they have seen every day on the street, I should say?

speaker-2 (51:52)

Yeah, if you're passing someone you see on the street every day, I often think you're seeing that person for a reason. And I don't think we can help everybody, but I think we can all just help one person. And, you know, I find if we really look at people on the street in the eyes, we'll know immediately in our heart, like this is the person I need to speak to and befriend. So I would say.

First of all, if you pass a homeless person today, like always make eye contact and smile because I found that really can change their whole day. It's just eye contact. Eye A reminder that they're human.

speaker-1 (52:28)

Just acknowledging them. How simple is that?

speaker-2 (52:33)

So simple, yeah, you're right. It's pretty simple.

speaker-1 (52:36)

And it's free everyone, it's free.

speaker-2 (52:39)

Yeah.

speaker-0 (52:41)

We are emotional beings and looking at somebody gives them, you know at that moment that validation of I'm alive Smiling is proven that it It gives a little bit of hope every time because somebody smiled it's I won't go into all of it. But yeah, it's a it's simple. Like you said, it's free. It's quick and we can all do it

speaker-2 (53:07)

That's so true. Yeah. And I would say if you feel the nudge to speak to a certain individual on the street, don't be afraid of that nudge.

speaker-1 (53:17)

I like that. That's the that's the world. That's the tell, know, telling you to do greater to move out of the norm. I love that. That'll nudge.

speaker-0 (53:28)

So share with our listeners, where can they get your book?

speaker-2 (53:35)

You can get it online on Amazon in Barnes and Noble. And you can also go to sarahmurphy.com and click on the book. And you can find links there.

speaker-0 (53:47)

I love it. yeah, so please check out that the book and yeah, it's right here on Amazon. Everybody knows who Amazon is or what Amazon is.

speaker-2 (53:57)

Yeah.

speaker-1 (53:58)

And a portion of every book sold is going to be helping feed the homeless. So you're giving back when you buy the book.

speaker-2 (54:08)

That is true, a portion of every book sold goes to Feeding America. yeah, my hope is, you I know this is a very busy world to live in. So often people come to me and are like, Sarah, I don't have time to volunteer with the, on-house. I'm like, well, if you buy the book, you can feed them. You know, it's kind of like, my hope was to make it easier for those and demand jobs.

speaker-0 (54:32)

That's fantastic. Well, Sarah, thank you so much. ⁓ Thank you for sharing your story with us. But more importantly, thank you for ⁓ writing this book, giving the homeless a voice, educating us, educating the public, our community, and helping us understand those people.

It's not always a drug issue. if a lot of times the drug, it's an addiction and they still need help. still, everybody needs love and every one of us are human. And if we're human, we all matter. And so, you know, I thank you. I think, thank you for your heart and, ⁓ taken the, ⁓ the moment to actually go out and do the things that, you know, maybe a lot of us actually wanted to do, but weren't, ⁓

brave enough to do. ⁓ So I love your heart. I love the mission, your own. Before we say goodbye, I'm curious, what is next for you? Are you writing another book? you, well, what's your next steps?

speaker-2 (55:48)

I do have a few books in the queue, but I think my main focus right now, I have written a pilot for the book. And my great dream is this book becomes a mini-series for television and just exposes people on a larger scale to how easily people can end up on house. And hopefully it, yeah, expands the message of seeking to befriend somebody without a home.

speaker-0 (56:17)

Make a friend.

speaker-2 (56:18)

Make a friend, yeah.

speaker-0 (56:20)

And speaking of friends, what I love about this conversation today is it's a reminder that nobody's just a category. ⁓ Every single person, they have a name, they have a story, they have a battle that they're fighting. And we all have something meaningful to contribute and so do they.

They just, they're in a, a season of need and help. And so we encourage you, and I'm sure like with Sarah encourages you to look them in the eye and start thinking of them as friends other than homeless, druggies, and all of the things that we've been so accustomed to. So thank you for your heart. Thank you for your dedication. Thank you for speaking up for the homeless, speaking up for those battling mental illness.

And thank you for being just who you are. Thank you so much. And friends, thank you for listening. And as always, we appreciate you. And until next time, please always do remember that you matter.

speaker-1 (57:33)

Thank you for joining us on this episode of You Matter Nashville. We hope you found inspiration on this episode and are reminded that no matter where you are or what you do, you matter.

speaker-0 (57:44)

If you enjoyed this episode, please be sure to subscribe, leave us a review, and even share it with your friends and family. Also, stay connected with us on social media and tune in next time for more incredible stories from the heart of our community.

speaker-1 (57:59)

Until then, remember, your story matters, your voice matters, and most of all, you matter.